Do you guys have any tips for using the diamond system for making bank shots more consistently? For some reason, I tend to have trouble with the angles.
- billiardsforum on 8/27/2006 7:40:12 PM
Ahhh the dreaded bank shot. If only we could all be Effren Reyes and makes them as easily as we make out straight shots.
It is doubtful that Effren, along with the majority of other professional billiard players, ever look at the diamond system. They are simply accurate judges of angles, and they draw on their many years of experience.
Just my oppinion, but ditch the diamond system.
- Ginger on 10/3/2006 4:42:24 PM
Here is an article on the basics of the billiard table diamond system.
Like @billiardsforum says, its probably not worth the time to learn, but it can help some people.
- Richard Sinor on 2/25/2007 7:39:58 PM
I never learned the diamond system but instead used the mirror image system for my one-rail banks. You visualize another table (with shared rail surfaces) connected to your table. You aim the object ball for the corresponding pocket on the imaginary table using moderate speed and no english. It works quite well for me.
- pocket6 on 3/3/2009 6:52:09 PM
If you are just going to put a "duck" into a pocket, it helps for me to aim at about the halfway point between the OB and CB and just hit it.
- Justanotherevolutionary on 3/7/2009 5:40:00 PM
I occasionally use the diamonds if the ob is off the rail a bit and the diamonds just so happen to line it up perfectly, otherwise I agree it is a feel and experience thing. I also use english on almost every bank shot. Kinda like golf and shot shaping. Why not make it as predictable as possible? Kick shots I use english EVERY time, well, unless of course it just can't work.
I really prefer to just cut the ball too. Unless the bank is an only option. I see way too many make-able cut shots passed up on APA league for banks. Usually the bank misses and cue ball is going who knows where, position play is a lot harder on a bank shot than a cut in my opinion.
- Line Up on 3/15/2009 6:30:20 PM
Mirror image, pocket the ball into the opposites side backwards as if the intended pocket was sitting directly behind the pocket on the opposite side.
- Justanotherevolutionary on 3/15/2009 9:12:52 PM
Here's a thought....feel it. Don't even look at it too long, just find the feel. Remember low english on the cb will transfer high english to the Ob and vise versa. High english on the cb decreases angle, low on the cb increases, figure this out and you will make 75% more banks. once you feel the Ob instead of the cb you will be making banks like second nature, same with kick shots play english off the rail instead of diamond and angle system. Control what YOU do, not what the table does. It's you vs. the table. Defeat it and you will defeat most opponents.
- 8ball on 4/3/2009 10:44:31 AM
A basic diamond system is well worth learning. It will help you a lot even if it isn't used all the time. I shoot most bank shots by feel. But sometimes I will double-check my spot by using a basic diamond system which is fairly simple to learn. Understanding the diamond system also helps you with position, especially when you want to take the cue ball around the table for your next shot. You can't learn too much. Knowledge is always king.
- Mitch Alsup on 4/3/2009 12:41:19 PM
A diamond system is more for making 3-rail banks/kicks than for making 1 rail banks/kicks.
1 rail banks and kicks are generally done with the "reflection" principle, you just have to remember that the ball reflects off the rail 1/2 balls' width from the contact point on the rail. you also have to take speed, roll, and english into account to make the shot; as all three alter the trajectory of the ball reflection off the rail (differently).
English changes the angle off the rail
Roll changes the angle for a few inches off the rail
Speed changes the angle off the rail and changes the amount of side-spin on the ball after rail contact.
- DavidSapolis on 6/21/2009 8:52:38 PM
The diamond system can be learn if you put your stick in line with rail and shoot toward it. The diamonds are there to make you line up. Hitting to the right of each diamond you aim at will make the object ball hit center pocket. learn my diamond technique and you will shoot like a pro.
- MS poolshooter on 10/16/2009 11:25:17 AM
I like Dr Cue's 7th pocket system.
In a nut shell. You pick an area along the rail straight in line with the OBJ ball (or when you get better, where you want to hit the OBJ ball at). Put the cue tip there, swing the butt end till the shaft is half way between the 2 balls if kick, or pocket and OBJ ball if bank, and then parallel shift along rail till your over the OBJ ball for bank or cue ball for kick shot. This is easier to teach in person than trying to describe in writing.
Or get Dr Cue's videos and watch yourself.
- quickshot on 10/16/2009 1:33:10 PM
Diamonds are a girls best friend, but necessarily a pool players. You can spend countless hours studing the diamond system and in one match have it go down the tube. And the reason: not all pool tables are created equal. Although, to be fair, the knowledge you gain would give you an edge garnished with a touch of luck.
- Mitch Alsup on 10/16/2009 2:41:43 PM
There is a trick that the diamond systems don't tell you--well they do, but its deap in the fine print. That is, the diamond systems are dependent on the way you hit the cue-ball. Most diamond systems require you to use running english. The reflective diamond system requires you to not use running english.
Secondly, the angle of reflection is dependent on the speed at which the cue-ball impacts the rail. The faster the speed, the less the angle of reflection. Another point, here, is that the cue-ball picks up side-spin as it encounters the rail, changing its reflecting angle on subsequent rails and changing the angle of contact if it hits an object-ball.
And then finally, notice that the missing diamond (the one a the corner pocket) is not in the center of the pocket! Measure it: take two diamonds as a reference and then measure from the first diamond to the pocket. Put a mark there to remind yourself where it really is.
With all these nuances to accomodate, what works best is to simply put 1 hour of banks and kicks into your daily practice session. Kick from corner to side, corner to corner, side to corner. Notice, carefully, that the corner to side has the cue-ball follow the same line as the side to corner but it looks a full inch different because of how the diamonds are recessed from the point of reflection.
Once you start getting the banks and kicks, start adding vertical englich (follow and draw) and see how these alter the shape of the reflecting ball "just after" reflecting off the rail. These become VERY useful later on when a simply kick is blocked. Once you see the subtle change in direction and get a grip on it, then start working on side-spin and see how this alters the angle of reflection immediately at the point of reflection. By seeing and understanding these two phenomona you can craft many shots to save your a$$. Then finally, for banks only, hit the object-ball softly with lots of side-spin on the cue-ball and watch how the object ball takes an angle off the rail. You can use these kinds of shots to manouver the object-ball around interfering balls and still pot them on command.
Diamond systems only get you started by pointing you in a geometric direction. Practice the above independently and you won't need the diamond systems and can simply see the reflection and the "physics of reflection" due to side-spin and verticla-spins.
- C. Carl McConnell on 12/23/2010 6:21:00 PM
There is a billiard book written by Willie Hoppe, which I have, that has a whole chapter that deals with the diamond system and its associated cue ball paths or tracts. This is a very good book, written by one of the all time true record holders of 3-cushion billiards. Its worth the effort to find a copy. I can not recall the title and I have misplaced my copy, but how many books did Willie Hoppe author that had a full chapter on banking pool shots?
It might have been Billiards: As it Should be Played. (links to amazon.com)
Another way to find the rail position to hit to kick a ball that works quite well is to draw a line from the two balls to the rail that your are going to kick off of then imagine an "X" connecting those two lines to the balls in question and where the "X" crosses is where you want to hit or drive the cue ball to the rail.