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Choice of Group when Table is Open and Pocketing Solid and Striped Balls


Choice of Group when Table is Open and Pocketing Solid and Striped Balls

I will be hosting 8-ball pool tournaments utilizing BCA rules and need some clarification about the choice of group when the table is open and the incoming player pockets both a solid and a striped ball.

When the table is still open and the shooter makes his called shot but also slops in a ball from the other group, is the table still open?

Remember I am looking specifically for the BCA 8-ball rules. I'm not asking for opinions but rather, the specific rules of 8 ball which apply to the question.

This question relates to the following billiard rules:

Choice of Group when Table is Open and Pocketing Solid and Striped Balls

Replies & Comments

  1. LuckyPRayMills on 5/13/2020 7:32:20 AM

    The "General Rules" section applies to this question.

    2-6 Establishing Groups

    1. Groups are established when the first object ball is legally pocketed on a shot after the break. The player legally pocketing the first ball is assigned that group, and the opponent is assigned the other group. You cannot establish a group on a safety.

    Source: playcsipool.com/uploads/7/3/5/9/7359673/official_rules_of_csi__170714_.pdf

    I didn't find any mention of pocketing a 2nd ball (from the other group) on the establishing shot, probably because the second ball's role was immediately determined by the above rule.

  2. LuckyPbilliardsforum on 6/2/2020 4:08:27 PM

    The WPA is the official world governing body of pool. The BCA officially follows the World Pool-Billiard Association rule sets. When you go to various BCA websites, their rules all either link-to, or reference the WPA rules. My answer will follow those.

    Your question indicates the player called the shot, thus, my answer assumes it's either:

    1. The breaking player who sunk 1 or more balls on the break, and is on their 2nd shot with a table that is still open (which is a valid scenario - see 3.3 below), or
    2. The incoming player after the breaking player's inning was over without the choice of group already being determined.

    WPA rules which apply to both of the above scenarios are as follows (emphasis ours):

    3.0 - Eight Ball

    3.3 Break Shot

    ...

    (c) If the breaker pockets a ball and does not foul, he continues at the table, and the table

    remains open. (See 3.4 Open Table / Choosing Groups.)

    ...

    3.4 Open Table / Choosing Groups

    Before groups are determined, the table is said to be “open,” and before each shot, the shooter must call his intended ball. If the shooter legally pockets his called ball, the corresponding group becomes his, and his opponent is assigned the other group. If he fails to legally pocket his called ball, the table remains open and play passes to the other player. When the table is “open”, any object ball may be struck first except the eight ball.

    So what rule 3.4 says, is that the group is determined by the player's first legally pocketed called shot during which he/she does not foul.

    In eight ball, the player need only call the shot and pocket. All ancillary pocketed balls (whether the opponent's group or not) remain down and have no effect on the choice of group, etc.

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Choice of Group when Table is Open and Pocketing Solid and Striped Balls

  • Title: Choice of Group when Table is Open and Pocketing Solid and Striped Balls
  • Author:
  • Published: 5/10/2020 10:34:08 AM
  • Last Updated: 6/2/2020 4:20:02 AM
  • Last Updated By: billiardsforum (Billiards Forum)